Patriarch Ilia Regrets Clergy’s Ill-Advised Actions in 17 May Events

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On Wednesday, Catholicos-Patriarch Ilia Ghudushauri-Shiolashvili, the First Hierarch of the Georgian Orthodox Church, said that Orthodox priests acted in an ill-advised manner during the developments on 17 May in downtown Tbilisi when a crowd led by Orthodox clergy disrupted an attempted anti-homophobia rally. Patriarch Ilia said at Holy Trinity Cathedral in Tbilisi, “What happened on 17 May is very regrettable. The ideas that [gay rights activists] wanted to propagate here are completely unacceptable in Georgia. However, it’s also very regrettable that Georgian clergy acted in an ill-advised manner, and I want to urge everyone to remain calm”.

Later that same day, the Georgian Patriarchate released a written statement expressing “regret” over the 17 May developments, saying that the Church would take “appropriate measure” against those clerics involved in the violence. The statement said that an attempt to hold a gay rights rally in downtown Tbilisi “was of provocative nature. In a country where the absolute majority of the population follows Christianity and other traditional religions, such rallies are perceived by the population as propaganda of homosexuality, which causes their fair protest”.

It said that venue of the intended rally, outside the former parliamentary building on Tbilisi’s main thoroughfare, Rustaveli Avenue, was “an additional irritating and provocative factor”. It described the venue as having “strong emotional ties” to Georgia’s “historical memory and traditions”. The statement went on to say, “The country can’t tolerate legalisation of a sin. The Church loves human beings and because of this love, it fights against sin for the salvation of souls. Despite that, there’s no excuse for violence. We unequivocally distance ourselves from the aggressive actions from the part of demonstrators, which weren’t within either legal or religious norms. It’s regrettable that clerics were involved in these processes. These separate individuals damaged the entire Church. The Patriarchate will examine their actions and we’ll take appropriate measures. It should also be noted that if were not for the efforts of large part of clergy and brave actions of the police, consequences would have been much more severe”.

23 May 2013

Civil Georgia

http://www.civil.ge/eng/article.php?id=26099

Editor’s Note:

Let’s keep it simple. Patriarch Ilia is going to lower the boom on the clerics nicked by the coppers. Then, he’ll say, “See, we disciplined these jabronies, there’s no need for you to act”. Trust me, that’s going to be the result. The Church CONDEMNS violence, even when it’s supposedly for a “good cause”, especially, when clerics egg people on to such acts. The Church paid bitterly for tolerating the Black Hundreds… I do daresay that it learned its lessons. The konvertsy can be quiet…  Patriarch Ilia’s gonna act, for charges have been laid against at least two of the clerics. We’re in Christ‘s Church, NOT the Church of the Grand Inquisitor.

BMD

 

Patriarch Ilia Called for Calm After Orthodox Groups Thwarted Gay Rights Rally

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Catholicos-Patriarch Ilia Ghudushauri-Shiolashvili, the head of the Georgian Orthodox Church, called for calm after violence erupted after aggressive anti-gay protesters, led by Orthodox clergy, thwarted a rally by a small group of gay rights activists to mark International Day Against Homophobia on 17 May. Patriarch Ilia said in televised remarks on Friday evening, “We distance ourselves from violence”. However, in reference to the gay rights rally, he said, “It’s something that shouldn’t be propagandised. We should know that this is a sin before God. We can express our sorrow without interfering in anyone’s private life. I hope that everything will calm down. I call on our people on all sides to go from the streets and return back home and to pray for each other”.

On 16 May, the Patriarch released a written statement calling on the authorities to ban the gay rights rally in downtown Tbilisi. Speaking to Orthodox believers gathered in Holy Trinity Cathedral, after the 17 May developments in Tbilisi, a senior cleric, Bishop Jakob Iakobishvili of Gardabani and Martqopi, said, “What happened today was an order coming from the nation. You know very well that the United National Movement required two-and-a-half months to gather 5,000 people [for its 19 April rally], then, they boasted, ‘See how many people we gathered’. Today, people came into [the streets] on their own initiative… Several millions would’ve come [into the streets] if needed”.

17 May 2013

Civil Georgia

http://www.civil.ge/eng/article.php?id=26071

Editor’s Note:

What the Church opposes absolutely is “gay propaganda”… that is, the suborning of minors and gay rights marches are beyond the pale. On the other hand, the Church takes a nuanced view of individual homosexuals… unlike the crazed konvertsy in the USA and their hysterical leaders such as Paffhausen and Moriak (Paffhausen shouldn’t have thrown stones given his mentor and hierarchical sponsor… the roads in his case DO lead to Platina and Dallas). The Church does NOT agree with sectarian Evangelical nonsense.

In short… some people overreacted and the Patriarch made it clear that the Church doesn’t condone violence… even violence supposedly in the service of “morality”. We don’t resort to the iron boot to impose “moral behaviour” (such is a contradiction in terms, no?). That’s the way of it in Christ’s Church…

BMD

Putin Sez Gay Rights Not Violated in Russia… Femen Strikes Again in Hannover

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On Monday, President Vladimir Putin denied that Russia violates the rights of sexual minorities, saying at a news conference after talks with Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte, “Sexual minority rights aren’t violated in Russia”, adding that they enjoy the same rights and freedoms as other Russians. He went on to say, “I consider it necessary to defend the rights of sexual minorities, but… children aren’t born in same-sex marriages. Both Europe and Russia face problems of demographic nature”. Putin noted that although one might solve demographic problems by encouraging migration, he’d like the Russian population to grow because of a demographic boom “in the so-called titular ethnic groups… Russians, Tatars, Chechens, Bashkirs, Dagestanis, and so on”.

Speaking about gay marriages, Putin mentioned the mentality of the Russian people and said that we should deal with such issues should in accordance with the tendencies prevailing in the public mood, stating, “Could you imagine an organisation promoting paedophilia in Russia? I think people in many Russian regions would take up arms. The same is true for sexual minorities… I could hardly imagine them allowing same-sex marriages in Chechnya. Can you imagine it? It would’ve resulted in human casualties”.

Putin reiterated that the gay propaganda rules recently adopted by several Russian regions, which are fiercely criticised by many Western public figures and rights groups, ban homosexual propaganda among minors. Promotion of LGBT values and lifestyle to minors is punishable in St Petersburg with fines of between 5,000 and 500,000 roubles (160 to 16,000 USD. 122 to 12,240 Euros. 105 to 10,480 UK Pounds). Several other Russian regions have similar bans in place. Putin observed, “I’d like to draw your attention to the fact that these laws were adopted on the regional level, and, thus, reflect the stance of the whole Russian society. They aren’t being encouraged by the federal authorities in any way. We need to reach a consensus with this community, to agree on working together. We shouldn’t bicker with each other, we should come to an agreement, to reach understanding, and lay down a certain set of civilised rules. I think this is possible”.

When asked about another trademark topless protest by activists from the feminist group Femen that targeted him as he opened an industrial fair in Hanover, Germany, Putin said, “Thank God, it wasn’t homosexuals who undressed there”. German media said that four women, with obscenities in English and Russian daubed on their breasts, broke through security as Putin and German Bundeskanzlerin Angela Dorothea Merkel were examining a stand at the fair.

8 April 2013

RIA-Novosti

http://en.ria.ru/russia/20130409/180521813/Gay-Rights-Not-Violated-in-Russia—Putin.html

Editor’s Note:

Putin, the KPRF, the Church, and Belarus are on the same page. As HH said, “We respect all human choices, including those of sexual orientation, but we reserve the right to call sin a sin”. That is, homosexuality isn’t going to be recriminalised any time soon (or any time later either). On the other hand, although adult homosexuals won’t be harassed legally (societal attitudes are a different story… one can’t change those by legislative fiat), they’re prohibited from “recruiting” amongst minors. In short, a real compromise is in force. Homosexuals are free from imprisonment, but they must be discreet in their doings. Compared to twenty years ago, it’s an advance, and a major one. In the terms of Russian society, it’s probably the best deal realistically out there.

That’s why American rightwing Orthodox are wrong in their witch-hunts of supposed “homosexuals” (note well that they don’t go after entrenched modernist homosexual elements, though… fancy that… nor do they notice them, either. Methinks that their “gaydar” is busted). The Church is clear… it doesn’t fancy homosexual clergy, but it shows oikonomia to lay homosexuals (especially, if they follow the Church’s teachings). The state is clear… relations between consenting adults are legal, but no “recruiting” of minors is kosher. That’s were Russian society is… it can’t go any further for quite some time. That’s the way it is…

BMD

US Congress Backs Expanded Protections For Domestic Violence Victims

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On Thursday, the US House of Representatives passed a new version of the Violence Against Women Act that would expand federal protections to gays, lesbians, and other vulnerable groups; US President Barack Obama pledged that he’d promptly sign the bill into law. The bill, approved by the US Senate last year, passed in the Republican-controlled House on Thursday by a vote of 286-138 after months of delay over rightwing objections to extending federal protections based on sexual orientation and expanding jurisdiction of Indian courts in domestic violence cases. In a statement posted on the White House website, President Obama said, “Renewing this bill is an important step towards making sure no one in America is forced to live in fear, and I look forward to signing it into law as soon as it hits my desk”.

The original US Violence Against Women law came into effect in 1994, backed by Vice President Joe Biden when he was a senator, and was credited with raising public awareness about domestic violence directed at women, assisting its victims, and prosecuting its perpetrators. The law expired in 2011; whilst politicians in both parties were in general agreement on the need to extend the measure, they were at odds on many details, including its expansion to protect homosexuals and bolstering the authority of Native American courts in prosecuting crimes on Indian reservations. Biden released a statement of his own, saying that domestic violence in the USA fell by 64 percent since the original law was passed, adding, “I’m pleased that this progress will continue, with new tools for cops and prosecutors to hold abusers and rapists accountable”. The Violence Against Women legislation authorises funding for a range of programmes that help victims of violence and support prosecution of people accused of domestic violence and sexual assault. The new law also contains provisions dealing with stalking as well as the improper use of spyware and video surveillance equipment.

28 February 2013

RIA-Novosti

http://en.rian.ru/crime/20130301/179742792/US-Congress-Backs-Expanded-Protections-From-Domestic-Violence—.html

Editor’s Note:

The crime that “may not be named” is clergy abuse. That is, it’s a sort of “domestic violence” that we often refuse to face, or we attack the victim, rather than the abuser. All too many of the konvertsy are hyperclerical, that is, they give clergy too much power over their lives (this is true of some fanatical semi-monastic sorts as well, but it’s not so marked in the cradle set). This is most patent amongst former cultists such as the HOOMies, for we had the stupidity to ordain their cult leaders as clergy. These jabronies control just about every facet of their flock’s lives… and the idiots just eat it up… reflect on this… they don’t want freedom. They reject it, even though Orthodoxy is the freest, most Zen-like, least juridical, and most tolerant part of Christendom. Why did they join us in the first place? Damned if I know… however, watch for them to criticise this new law. Bear in mind, part of it is due to the fact that they tolerate abusive clergy, and that they think that abusive situations in marriage are just as normal and moral. That’s nasty… they oppose people having recourse to the law… both in abusive marriages and in abusive church settings. That’s a meaty bone to gnaw upon, no? It takes all kinds… and some are beyond the pale… NEVER forget that.

BMD

The Hegira of the Manton Six: Zealotry Without Knowledge

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Our starting point is always wrong. Instead of beginning with ourselves, we always want to change others first and ourselves last. If everyone would begin first with themselves, then, there would be peace all around!

Elder Tadej Štrbulović of Vitovnica

Our Thoughts Determine our Lives

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Save your own soul, and thousands will be saved about you.

St Serafim Sarovsky

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By now, most of you have heard of the six monks who up and left St John of San Francisco Monastery in Manton CA because they disliked the pastoral dispensation that Meletios Webber gave an individual (note well who took them in… the rather questionable bunch at Platina… Podmoshensky‘s old haunt). Here’s what passed between a friend and me (I’m in italics):

That’s what I was alluding to in my latest post. Transgendered, ungendered, supergendered… it’s no one’s business. If the Church extends oikonomia, they should shut up or go to the bishop. It’s that simple.

I’d agree. Those monks who left are the bad guys in this latest.

The main actor in this little Kabuki play is one Martin Gardner. It’s another konvertsy melodrama (just like the Toll Houses and an obsession with homosexuals)… it’s turning out to be the same ol’, same ol’, kids. The only thing to say is, “Gad, sir, that ain’t Orthodox!” Virtually all Anglo-Saxon converts are addicted to akrivia of one sort or another, especially former Episkies. If a bishop or priest shows pastoral oikonomia towards anyone, they all crawl out of their dustbins and caterwaul about how the Church’s going to hell in a handbasket, and they “know” what they’re talking about, ‘cause they saw what happened to PECUSA. If they were to ask a real canonist like Alexander Lebedeff, he’d tell them, “Read the canons! It says, ‘or as the bishop shall prescribe’… that’s the Orthodox way!” Indeed, we drive the papists absolutely nutso at times…

But X agrees with us!

Yes, they do… it’s their opinion.

You mean that you don’t agree with it?!?

No… the Church doesn’t define it… it’s not central to salvation.

That’s the Orthodox way. Orthodoxy is fond of giving people the “second chance”… hell, it loves giving people “third” and “fourth chances” too. We’re willing to bend the rules, if it’s going to save a soul. Mind you, oikonomia does carry a “price tag”. Second marriages are “allowed”, not “blessed”. Someone married twice may not become a priest (as the Church recognises civil marriage, unlike the RCs, Matthew Tate has to be defrocked immediately, as he’s a divorced man). Homosexuals are not driven out of the Church (click here for the bio of Nikon Mironov, a gay bishop (who got into trouble for personality problems unrelated to his sexual orientation… however, do note that the Church doesn’t make an issue of his orientation as Mironov supports the public teaching of the Church))… all the former Episkies bloviating on “gays” are full of it and should shut up. The Church opposes homosexual propaganda and the notion that homosexuality and heterosexuality are equal.

That being said, HH said, “We respect all human choices, including those involving sexual orientation. However, we reserve the right to label sin as ‘sin’”. This isn’t what the extremist konvertsy want to hear. For instance, the late Patriarch Aleksei Rediger of Happy Memory gave Nikon Mironov a high Church decoration and HH gave him a panagia in 2010… for Nikon is a defender of traditional Church order and Tradition. He burned Schmemann’s books on a public bonfire; he can’t be all bad! Note well how the Church dealt with Nikon… they sent him to the Pskovo-Pechersky Lavra to do penance for his abuse of the laity in Yekaterinburg (at the Lavra, the late Elder Ioann Krestiankin (a real saint) dealt lovingly with him). Then, the Church authorities allowed Nikon to settle near Moscow; the Church made him the honorary rector of a parish (he was NOT deposed from the episcopate; my understanding is that he agreed not to serve publicly). Therefore, one can see that the Church just doesn’t kick homosexuals in the arse and abuse them, as the former Episkies do (that’s why I contend that very few of them are converted-in-fact).

In short, Martin Gardner and his five confrères are not only chock full of beans, they’re prime candidates for punishment, as they made public a private pastoral matter. I only deal with “public figures”, “public occurrences”, and “public matters”. Private pastoral matters are not for us to publicise. If you have a “problem” with the pastoral oikonomia extended by a priest or bishop, go to the ruling bishop. I know what an old ROCOR priest said many moons ago about giving communion to a gay person (it was LOUD, trust me)… (heavy Russian accent) “If you have problem with this, go talk to bishop!!” Need I say that the person making the complaint didn’t go to the bishop? Fancy that…

That’s the way it is in the real Church. It’s the salvation station for every nation… and it’s more compassionate than the zealots wish to admit.

NB:

The fact that Nikon Mironov is a “retired bishop” indicates that such a status is fully-canonical, and that those who question such a status aren’t in the mainstream of the Church.

Barbara-Marie Drezhlo

Thursday 12 July 2012

Albany NY

25 January 2012. The REAL DEAL on Lay Homosexuals… the Konvertsy are Chock Fulla Shit, As Per Usual

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A kitchen cabinet member sent me this:

If certain priests had withheld Chrism as often as some others withhold Communion, we wouldn’t be having this debate. In my estimation, on average, the character of those aspiring to the priesthood has declined over the last 40 years. Don’t panic. We have options. If you want a priest to commune an ordinary gay person, talk to his wife. There are powers-that-be that can make life very uncomfortable for certain priests; as we say, “Mатушка сказала” (“Matushka skazala”: Matushka said so). What if he’s unmarried? Then, call out the babas. It might be distressing for the hipsters to learn, but the repository for what’s normative in the church resides amongst women over 60. When I first came “out” and was still attending my church in the narthex, there were babushkas that would purposely come stand near me. One even smiled, once. Have we lost the sense of loyalty to each other that we’ve forgotten our ethos? Anyone with good manners, who spent a decent amount of time drinking tea with the babushkas, who thanked them for their cooking, who went to confession, and who showed up at Vigil never got a second look in Communion line, no matter how flaming/butch they were. Furthermore, if you’d visited them in hospital or taught their grandsons the Bible, you were golden.

Let’s be clear here. Lay homosexuals have NEVER been an important issue in the Church in the American diaspora, or in the homeland. The Church has been around for over two millennia, it knows a thing or two. There’s a key differentiation between lay gays and open clerical poofters. We leave the former alone; we don’t tolerate the latter. It’s why the MP Holy Synod deposed Bishop Nikon Mironov in Yekaterinburg in ’99… he was bloody-minded, but his theology was straight (after all, he burned ADS’ nasty Renovationist tomes in public). Yet, his homosexuality became open… so, the Synod shit-canned him and sent him off to the Pskovo-Pechersky Monastery (the abode of the late Elder Ioann Krestiankin of Happy Memory) to repent. After some years, they allowed him to live in retirement in Veshnyaki Raion in the eastern outskirts of the city of Moscow, where he’s the honorary rector of a parish (the Synod removed him as the ruling bishop of Yekaterinburg; they didn’t depose him). In 2008, Patriarch Aleksei Rediger gave him the Order of St Sergei of Radonezh, and, in 2010, His Holiness gave a panagia on the occasion of his 50th birthday. That’s what REAL Orthodox do with exposed clerical Sallies, if their theology’s straight. You’ll note that they didn’t put him under an anathema and throw him under the train as Fathausen and his minions do. He lost his clerical position, he had to go for a period of repentance, but that was all, so, he’s not only an Orthodox believer, but an Orthodox cleric (I do think that he’s under an order not to serve publicly, though), today. On the other hand, the Church deals with homosexuality in monastic houses harshly. However, even there, the worst that happens is that the miscreant’s laicised and sent away, we don’t throw them out of the Church. I asked a Russian priest of my acquaintance about the usual practise concerning lay homosexuals:

You know, Alekseyev {a prominent gay activist: editor} is a communing Orthodox believer. As long as they’re respectful, don’t disrupt services, and do what everybody else does, there’s no problem. The Church is against propaganda in favour of sexual minorities {“gays” in Russian usage: editor} amongst children, it’s against gay parades because they’re provocations, and it won’t bless homosexual unions, but it doesn’t bless hatred against sexual minorities, either. Homosexuality’s a sin… but so are greed and adultery, and we don’t expel adulterers and misers.

That’s why Moriak is chock fulla shit on Mark Stokoe. Mark wasn’t “in the closet”. Everyone knew of his “state”… Archbishop Job Osacky knew… Fr Ted Bobosh knew… hell, even I knew (and I don’t know everything). Moriak KNEW of Vladyki Job’s oikonomia, yet, one of his first actions was to piss on Mark to curry favour with Fathausen. Moriak also went against the “institutional culture” of the Diocese of the Midwest… that was unwise in the extreme. When you add in how Moriak set up his son in a comfy situation in the diocese (and the whispers about Moriak’s tastes in certain matters), it’s a recipe for a gigantic and malodorous Shit Sandwich, and Moriak had the brainlessness to force everybody to take a big bite (boy, what THAT ever STOOPID and hutsky-klootsky).

It’s simple… individual lay homosexuals aren’t harassed and attacked, although we do depose gay clerics like Gleb Podmoshensky… do recall how Fathausen, Freddie M-G, and Dreher all had guru-disciple ties with him after his deposition… it certainly puts a new “spin” on Fathausen’s loud fulminations against homosexuality, doesn’t it? Do bear in mind that closeted gay clerics (of all sorts, not merely Orthodox) are usually acridly and vehemently anti-gay in an attempt to draw attention away from themselves. If you want my plain blunt opinion, Podmoshensky’s a covert manipulator of Fathausen (along with Potapov), and, through Fathauen, manipulates the witless konvertsy… they’re all acridly anti-gay in public, yet, their real leader is as queer as a three-dollar bill. That’s why Fathausen has to go… his guru’s an unrepentant sodomite deposed by the ROCOR Holy Synod for good cause.

The REAL Church shows compassion to all… it doesn’t hold anyone up to public obloquy. Look at the Church’s real Christian forbearance and compare it to the abusive hatred spewed forth by the loud OCA konvertsy. Well… it looks like the konvertsy aren’t Orthodox in their heart-of-hearts, does it? Mark it well… the Church is the BIG TENT… that’s why they call it the Orthodox Church!

Barbara-Marie Drezhlo

Wednesday 25 January 2012

Albany NYPanagia,